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make heavy tanks

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reading this thread about the artillery: http://zero-k.info/Forum/NewPost?threadID=4967

this brings up a topic i had in mind for some time. this is about the reaper and the goliath tanks.

i have the impression that heavy tanks should really be what they are called, becasue, they are NOT.
crushers of doom, which can take a shitload of damage. they MUST not fear static defences.

therefore i have the following suggestions:

-increase HP, at least 1.5-2.0 times the current value for both tanks
-corrspondingly cut their speed by the HP gain value. reapers are ridiculously fast, and even golis have a decent speed. (hello? e=mc² and stuff. their engines for their HP ( assuming hp means mass) must be larger than their weaponery power...)
-keep price and firerate. see how this turn sout.
-bonus: experiemnt with turret turning rate. slow it down and maybe add higher damage.

=> slow fortresses of death to everything slow, high HP thing.
=> weak to fast units with good kiting AI - needs banisher assistance
=> weak to air bombardment - needs copperhead assistance
=> weak to terrorform - needs construction assistance (maybe a con on guard state to this unit restores terrorform on its waypoints?)

ravagers lack hp but have insane speed. reapers are not a replacement with just higher HP and cost, but are unique to them. this makes heavy tank fac much more different compared to LV.

-----

so you are sitting in your fortification and get the creep when you see this massive barrel slowly rolling towards your doors.
+1 / -1
erk, NO

just no...

really, this is worse then neonstorm...

tl:dr NO

side note: AGAIN no, your doing it wrong

PS: NO
IRL TANKS: usualy die from 1-2 enemy tank shells and ANTI-tank weapon(porc) will slaughter a tank
+1 / -0
No, go on. I want to know what e=mc² has to do with this.
+1 / -0
11 years ago
They may need a slight buff but 2x hp? This could make them the most unbalanced unit in the game. That kind of work is what the bantha is for.
+0 / -0
The assault tanks are the last thing in that lab that needs any TLC. The tank lab sports the most expensive riot unit in the game (which, despite its cost, can't fight raiders unsupported), two different artillery units that can't hit the broad side of a barn, the fiddliest raider in the game, and no skirmisher. It's kind of a mess.
+0 / -0
Yeah banisher for cost kinda sucks. Thats why probably everyone just makes reapears.
+0 / -0


11 years ago
You make reapers when you can afford many. Same as ravagers.

First combat unit out of tankfac is still usually banisher, because it's so anti-everything.
+0 / -0
nonsense

I make reapers when I cant afford to make anything else, because its easy to survive and repair it. I make reapers when I can afford many of them, because banisher is crap and doesnt have use in later game anyway.
+0 / -0
11 years ago
Banisher is an awesome skirmish/riot. It is so awesome that I wont attack unless I know I can kill it first.
+0 / -0

11 years ago
The banisher is a fine unit, I just mean that it's only partially in the "riot" role since (a) you can't really roll out a unit that expensive very early like you can other riot units, and (b) it can be overwhelmed simply by baiting it to fire and then striking.

I didn't mean to say the Banisher isn't a bad unit, just that it's one more wrinkle in the messy lab.
+0 / -0
11 years ago
Banisher is everything, but not riot.

For cheap riots AOE is fine, because you can make a circle of them to avoid surrounding, a line to cover a great area, and replace damaged ones.

Banishers shoot each other if dirtboxes and fleas get close, 2 can win against ravager-spam, but are easily killed by glaives.

Banisher could be so much better if it could survive along Reapers in groups, don't shot at own tanks with AOE, make cost vs glaives.


Missiles also look (look&feel) somewhat expensive vs cheap things.
+0 / -0
But it's fun to annihilate that one glaive with 4 missiles of doom and destruction! Seriously though I don't think the Banisher is particularly OP or UP, but it definitely can't be used like other riots.
+0 / -0
11 years ago
As I said, it is everything BUT riot!
+0 / -0
"Warhammer 40K colossal tank crushing enemies" feeling of crushing your enemies under the heels of the colossal tank.

Colossal. Crushing.

Balance, shmalance, the feeling is gone.

This is missing from the current heavy tank setup. The last player I saw go all tanks in a 20x20 map, when we had finally been pushed to the back of our plateau, sent in eight Ravagers and two Goliaths, supported by repairers and my little shield bot minions. Say what you will about my playing style, but my "queue build order in proportion to cost of units" method rarely leaves me too specialized.

The tanks lost. To five Zeuses, about twice that many rockos, light air support (Banshees and a Licho. I had AA) a L4 comm, and static defenses that cost half what they did.

He finally gave up kiting, ducking and weaving to retreat back to what little static I had managed to whip up in that time.

Gone are the days when @Lassitude would crank up the Soviet National Anthem for his tank rush. They are gone.

+1 Mojjj. +1.
+0 / -1


11 years ago
I had the impression that reaper and golliath are extremely strong units, with careful handling and repairs they make cost and dont fear defenses.

Whats the problem with them?
+1 / -0
11 years ago
I once saw goliath pushed arround by 3 glaves. Was verry funny.
+0 / -0


11 years ago
nonsense thread, tanks absolutely bully other facs with their hardcore bigness.

reaper is best unit ever
banisher forces enemies and kill it in one attack, or else take massive casualties
golly is a bit limp and inaccurate but powerful vs heavies with its slow
+1 / -0
11 years ago
golly innacurate? play more heavy tanks. After banisher and panther goliath has best aim.
+0 / -0


11 years ago
the joke is, you're wrong.
+0 / -0
11 years ago
you serious? i mean seriously? facepalming pls...
+0 / -0
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