When they get too numerous the game starts to looks silly and you can't keep up dodging their rockets with glaives anymore. The same is kinda true for rugues, but you see those less often. Rogues dance is the funnier of the two though :P I think a skirmisher should not be this spammable. The simplest solution is to increase cost and weight a bit to ~110-ish for roko. Their current cost too close too that of raiders. Please don't suggest any silly things here. Or a complete revamp of the unit. The roko is awesome, it just needs a slight adjustment. Which is mostly aesthetic anyway. To put it shortly, they should be more vulnerable to raiders by cost increase.
+1 / -0
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Another option would be increasing burst and reload time. Higher damage per shot less shots easier to dodge. This would making them stronger against static defense though. Keep in mind that a weight increase would also make them less vulnerable to Roaches, Ticks and napalm.
+1 / -0
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Very true Skasi. 110-ish cost shouldnt affect its instagibabillity.
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I think they shouldn't get more HP with cost increase, since their HP/cost is somewhat high now. Rocko's being cheap also makes them quite good vs HLT. replay me recovering from bad air start with slow expand using rockospam http://zero-k.info/Battles/Detail/259746
+0 / -0
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just nerf anything, people have been whinning for months
+0 / -1
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Note that increasing cost would be against Quant's rule. On the other hand, reducing health would put an emphasis on the skirm role, helping raiders destroy them (especially if the health was at mex value, reducing overkill from high-alpha raiders whose damage is usually designed around it).
+4 / -0
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From another thread: quote:
Banisher 2.11
Recluse 2.16
Grizzly 4.5
Rocko 5.33
Zeus 6.85 |
HP is the biggest problem IMO and seems hitting that would be the best way to nerf rocko. High HP means they can tank phoenix napalm relatively well, won't die to raiders very quickly and smash through porc like it's nothing. Another nice thing about reducing HP is that it wouldn't nerf rocko's ability to fight those targets that they actually need to counter (projectile velocity decrease or cost increase would). Edit: ninja'd
+5 / -0
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Rocko shots are meant to be dodgeable, so I think a projectile speed nerf wouldn't be unreasonable either.
+0 / -0
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There's a question of "dodgeable by what?" that needs to be asked. Rocko needs to be able to fight other skirms, and they're all pretty nimble.
+0 / -0
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Rocko *does not* need to be able to fight other Skirms. Glaives can do that, and are other of the better raiders for it. Fighting other skirmishers effectively is not a property of skirmishers, and many skirmishers already are quite lacking in this category.
+1 / -0
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@"hp nerf": Some years ago Licho pointed out that hp is already very low in ZK and that balance changes should not focus too much around nerfing hp and buffing dmg. Just pointing that out. Note that Rocko is the cheapest unit on the list. Rogue has 4.75 too. I don't wanna say "don't nerf hp under any circumstance", but only propose to keep a change low.
+0 / -0
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And sometime ago rocko was so weak and needed buff..
+0 / -0
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True @[ffc]Killer! Wow I didn't even think of that. How about just reverting the last two buffs? r10546 and r10560 from Jun 25, 2013 added: burnblow changed: flighttime 2.2->2.1 changed: range 450->460 changed: weapon velocity 180->200 removed: trajectoryHeight 0.05
+2 / -0
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Reverting those sounds good to me as well. Those buffs were not supposed to be there, nobody discussed them because KingRaptor committed them as a behaviour fix which he thought would have a negligible effect on gameplay. I would at least like to see if the effect really was negligible.
+0 / -0
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The burnblow rockets look cooler than the previous ones though.
+0 / -0
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Hmm, did the removal of trajectoryHeight make dodging shots harder for crawling bombs? I have the feeling that running below shots is not an option now, was it before?
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lel, stealth buff for rokko comming out from a "nerf rokko" thread just to point out, i used rokko spam before it was cool XD rokko were allways quite good, its just that some noob (ie. floris) has finaly discovered that they are cool... tl:rd stop listening to noobs that have never met a skirmished before
+0 / -1
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Last thread, both google and I agreed that weapon velocity nerf would be fair. Given that the last major change was a weapon velocity BUFF, I'd say that's a good area to look at! The 'behaviour' changes like Burnblow and the trajectory height are fine, but I think the range down to 450 and weapon velocity down to 180 is a good plan. I'd like to know why KR buffed those stats in the first place though. To be fair that was a year ago, but still.
+1 / -0
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Yup, burnblow is nice. Trajectory height was not a pure buff, it also makes shooting over obstacles harder, so that's fine too. Lower flighttime sounds fine too as the removal of trajectory makes the flight path shorter, right?
+0 / -0
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But this doesn't address the spammable skirmish issue. A roko still cost about as much as a bandit.
+0 / -0
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