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Title: El_Ragan's Battle
Host: RUrankEl_Ragan
Game version: Zero-K v1.8.5.3
Engine version: 104.0.1-1510-g89bb8e3
Battle ID: 906075
Started: 4 years ago
Duration: 2 hours
Players: 4
Bots: False
Mission: False
Rating: Casual
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Manual download

Team 1
Chance of victory: 3.2%

RUrankSTALINPIZDET
Team 2
Chance of victory: 39.9%

RUrankarkashahan
Team 3
Chance of victory: 7.6%

RSrankridick
Team 4
Chance of victory: 49.3%

RUrankEl_Ragan
Spectators
USrankAdminJasper
RUrankrewdrfe2

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4 years ago
15 clumped webs are enough to stop disco forever.
+0 / -0

4 years ago
But webs need recharged and for 10s it should not be damaged. This mean you need micromanage them and change position?
+0 / -0
4 years ago
No watch replay they seem to recharge when underfired. I guess their shields are misaligned.
+0 / -0
Shields don't count as damaged if a projectile penetrates them.

(Because something else takes the damage that the shield let through, heh)

So after 10 seconds of idleness, the very next frame Funnelweb immediately begins to charge, and keeps charging until it has enough charge to stop a shot.

Funnelweb has a shield regeneration of 300. DRP has six weapons, all of which shoot once per six seconds (so one gun shoots every second).

The (shield) damages on those guns are:
Red Killer - direct 3000
Orange Roaster - direct 300 + fire aoe (negligible in this case)
Yellow Slammer - direct 800 + impulse (negligible, shields don't get repulsed)
Green Stamper - direct 400 + seismic (irrelevant)
Blue Shocker - 4000 (12000 emp, divide by three)
Violet Slugger - 450 direct + 4500 slow (which translates to another 1500 shield).

So each 6s cycle does 3000+300+800+400+4000+450+1500 damage to shields, giving us theoretical anti-shield DPS of 1741. As long as they are all charging, just 6 funnelwebs are needed to tank DRP forever (with 1800 shield generation per second).

Because DRP damage is discontinuous and penetrating shots don't count, all funnelwebs that are drained by DRP itself will be charging after 10 second downtime after having tanked a shot - it can't keep them down until they charge to take a hit, unless it kills or stuns them.

Having more of them just allows some extra give in the system. I truly don't get why people build DRP (except that it's cheap; well, you get what you pay for).

A single Funnelweb takes 6 seconds of charge-time to eat one second of DRP fire-time, plus ten seconds of idle-time after taking the hit, so theoretically 16 is the number where they become truly invincible without any intervention.

At lower quantities they are likely slowly being drained, but if you rotate them out, 7 should be sufficient to achieve indefinite resilience - one to take the damage for six seconds (it can take about 10 seconds, so there's plenty of room for inefficiency), the other six to generate that sweet 1800 shield per second of recharge.

TL:DR 7 Funnelweb counters DRP.
+2 / -0

4 years ago
Make small spires in front of each funnelweb and have a wubget that moves them onto the spire whenever they're charged.
+0 / -0

4 years ago
quote:
Having more of them just allows some extra give in the system. I truly don't get why people build DRP (except that it's cheap; well, you get what you pay for).


On smaller maps DRP is better not only because cheaper but it can stun every other superweapon with its emp hit. It can melt with direct fire almost any approaching army while zenith need longer recharge but DRP is ready from start. Also DRP is more potent vs terraform then Zenith. In range and tactical single strike Zenith of course outperform DRP. However DRP suffer from long turn rate. It takes eternity to turning it to another target. It should be buffed.
+0 / -0

4 years ago
Funnel regen is nice but in all that calculation we must also account also energy expenditures. So for funnel cost need also some singu cost for regen.
+0 / -0
I expect you to have a singu or two just for overdrive in the superweapon phase, and several funnelwebs to protect your stuff from tacnukes.

On smaller maps, funnelweb also covers a larger percentage of the map. In particular, on this map a funnelweb can protect your whole island. This is an argument against DRP.

But even if you account for singus, 7 Funnelwebs only cost 21k. You can afford 3 singus on top and still be cost-effective.
+0 / -0


4 years ago
These recent events are making me think it might actually be worth the complexity to have Funnelwebs whose shields are in cooldown interfere with the recharge of other Funnelweb shields in proportion to the area of overlap of the shields of the two Funnelwebs...
Funnelweb balls would then be basically enable to recharge if bombarded and would thus fall out of favour.

(or could just remove Funnelweb I guess, but that would be sad)
+0 / -0


4 years ago
I think DRP just needs a buff. I had a conversation with Sprung the other day and im convinced that DRP is the problem. At first I though ODable supers would solve the problem but it seems so much of drp's damage is done through stuff thats weak against shields.
+0 / -0
4 years ago
DRP is fine
+0 / -0

4 years ago
DRP need faster turn rate and fire start. That's all.
Nurf needed for funnelweb or need drone return with old puny shield. Its like with old funnel - when they reach critical mass then you cant do anything against them. But if drone funnel could break break stalemates then shield funnel is mostly making them and prolonging game in many cases. Not even mentioning reclaim trolling or weird porcpushing with them.
+0 / -0
quote:
I think DRP just needs a buff. I had a conversation with Sprung the other day and im convinced that DRP is the problem.

My point was that it's the specific relationship between DRP and Funnelweb. DRP is fine vs everything else that isn't Funnel.

A large chunk of DRP's power is concentrated in effects that are normally crappy vs shields (impulse, roast, status effects) but its 4000 EMP damage was designed back when the largest shield health in the game was 3600 so it still effectively countered them. Funnel broke this.

A dumb way to solve this would be to just increase the EMP damage since that disproportionately punishes Funnel (current 12K EMP is enough to stun most things to the cap anyway).
+3 / -0

4 years ago
Fire rate of DRP is disappointingly slow. If it helped counteract Funnels by keeping shield recharge locked for longer, then spinning it 2-3x faster would be a nice change.
+0 / -0

4 years ago
Make DRP slowly accelerate its fire rate over time. So it can push through any ball if you keep firing long enough.
+2 / -0