Automation tools

I'm curious about two questions.

1) What tools do you use to automate things in Zero-K? I remember there was a widget which sent idle workers to assist and reclaim stuff which I used briefly but don't any more.

2) What level of automation do you think is appropriate for competitive play?

I use global build command.

I wonder at which point automation starts hurting the game. I'm not sure whether that point has already been reached or whether the game will ever reach it.

I personally am a big opponent of too much automation. I like to play the game (and know that my opponent is doing the same) instead of merely guiding a bunch of fancy widgets into doing all the playing for us.

quote: guiding a bunch of fancy widgets into doing all the playing for us.

I'd personally be fascinated by this.

I think the limit still is communicating the decisions you make to the game though.
Even when only thinking about glaive battles, we currently have line move to do that more or less directly, but still it's mainly used to communicate "close the distance", "back off", "focus here", "spread out" etc.

quote: I heard it's a planned feature for Spring 101

No comment.

I pretty much agree with what [ISP]Lauri said.

I think ultimately the factor that should decide whether a process should be automated or not is if it is boring or not. For instance, having to constantly inject larvae and build supply depots in SC2 is a boring repetition. On the other hand, microing units is not a boring process and should not be automated, which is why I've never been particularly fond of autoskirm in ZK.

Certain things need automation IMO. Other things are grey areas, or definitely don't.

If something has a low skill cap that is unfun, it should be automated. Starcraft macro mechanics IMO should be automated, but they were introduced for a very specific reason (getting the BW crowd to transition into SCII, IMO it's mindless traditionalism/hierarchical maintenance, but blizzard gotta shift product). If these things are not automated, then the UI should support doing them painlessly.

Stuff like auto-micro? Well, I don't take issue with it in ZK since optimisation requires micromanagement. It brings up the effective skill level of those at the bottom of the ladder, allowing them to experience some semblance of what the game's about. Sidenote, I think it'd be interesting to see how well players compare only using attack move, how ahead are the top 10 in ZK when the micro playing field is leveled?

I can't think of any automation unit-wise that feels as good or superior to microing the same unit, which feels like a bit of a Goldilocks zone. It's always a trade-off between efficiency and attention for other things.

Xivender wrote an eraser+roach script to automatically launch roaches and refill fast. and a commander screening script to protect his cloaked trollcom by a circle of jethros. sad he never shared.

quote: I can see a policy on widget sharing being necessary if steam brings more widget makers.

I can see one will have troubles enforcing that.
Even GPL policy states you are not obligated to release privately used code: http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.en.html#GPLRequireSourcePostedPublic

I am super duper pro automation

If a simple script can do something as well as me, I'd rather have the script than have more work to do - I want to make decisions, not click loads.

I'm also totally cool with people trying to get an edge with their own widgets - its super cool, and there is no other game with such a meta :D