| 1 |
I'm really glad you're putting attention towards this Google. The bulletpoints you have listed are spot on already.
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1 |
I'm really glad you're putting attention towards this Google. The bulletpoints you have listed are spot on already.
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| 2 |
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2 |
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| 3 |
I've communicated to Dein a rough outline of how a ladder should feel, so he is aware, and it sounds a lot like your bullet points.
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3 |
I've communicated to Dein a rough outline of how a ladder should feel, so he is aware, and it sounds a lot like your bullet points.
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| 4 |
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4 |
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| 5 |
Before this update, the flucuations in your elo were relatively small upon win or loss. I'll give you some examples.
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5 |
Before this update, the flucuations in your elo were relatively small upon win or loss. I'll give you some examples.
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| 6 |
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6 |
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| 7 |
Beating a player above you netted maybe 5-6 elo.
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7 |
Beating a player above you netted maybe 5-6 elo.
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| 8 |
Beating the player directly beneath you netted maybe 4.
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8 |
Beating the player directly beneath you netted maybe 4.
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| 9 |
Beating someone many places below you gave you 1 or even a fraction of 1 elo.
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9 |
Beating someone many places below you gave you 1 or even a fraction of 1 elo.
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| 10 |
Beating Godde gave you 12-20 elo.
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10 |
Beating Godde gave you 12-20 elo.
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| 11 |
Being beaten by Godde lost you 1 elo.
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11 |
Being beaten by Godde lost you 1 elo.
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| 12 |
Being beaten by someone many places below you lost you 12-20 elo.
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12 |
Being beaten by someone many places below you lost you 12-20 elo.
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| 13 |
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| 14 |
We can see from this that the most extreme value change was in the low double digits. Not life altering, not ladder fear inducing. It was hard work to climb, but relatively forgiving if you lost and came back fighting.
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14 |
We can see from this that the most extreme value change was in the low double digits. Not life altering, not ladder fear inducing. It was hard work to climb, but relatively forgiving if you lost and came back fighting.
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| 15 |
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15 |
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| 16 |
After the change, elo fluctuations of 20 are the low end. I remember being beaten by someone outside the top 20 (but not by much) immediately after the change, when I was in the #2 position, and losing over 100 elo in a single match. That plummeted me back down after months of climbing by 1 point at a time. You can see why I'm outspoken about the change.
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16 |
After the change, elo fluctuations of 20 are the low end. I remember being beaten by someone outside the top 20 (but not by much) immediately after the change, when I was in the #2 position, and losing over 100 elo in a single match. That plummeted me back down after months of climbing by 1 point at a time. You can see why I'm outspoken about the change.
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| 17 |
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| 18 |
So, tell me what was wrong with the old model so I can better weigh in on a real solution from an "invested player" point of view.
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18 |
So, tell me what was wrong with the old model so I can better weigh in on a real solution from an "invested player" point of view.
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| 19 |
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| 20 |
To touch on what Wesley said, before this ladder change I hadn't even considered what ladder anxiety meant. It never occured to me as a thing. I'd witnessed one or two people routinely dodging and figured they were egotistically flawed. People would dodge because they were OLD purples, and didn't want to be seen being beaten by new up-and-comers.
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20 |
To touch on what Wesley said, before this ladder change I hadn't even considered what ladder anxiety meant. It never occured to me as a thing. I'd witnessed one or two people routinely dodging and figured they were egotistically flawed. People would dodge because they were OLD purples, and didn't want to be seen being beaten by new up-and-comers.
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| 21 |
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| 22 |
After the change, the justification for ladder anxiety has become way more logical - and thus more common. People are guarding their LONG fought for hoard of 'old elo'. And I fully, fully understand it now. This change is percieved as a real threat to their investment.
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22 |
After the change, the justification for ladder anxiety has become way more logical - and thus more common. People are guarding their LONG fought for hoard of 'old elo'. And I fully, fully understand it now. This change is percieved as a real threat to their investment.
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| 23 |
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23 |
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| 24 |
When
you're
an
improving
player,
the
ranking
system
is
one
of
your
only
tangible,
post-game
metrics
and
you
can
become
overly
invested
in
seeing
it
-
and
emotionally
attached.
Well,
when
the
fluctuations
are
in
the
triple
digits
-
Ain't
no
one
fuckin'
with
that.
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24 |
When
you're
an
improving
player,
the
ranking
system
is
one
of
your
only
tangible,
post-game
metrics
and
you
can
become
overly
invested
in
seeing
it
-
and
emotionally
attached.
Well,
when
the
fluctuations
are
in
the
triple
digits
-
Ain't
no
one
fuckin'
with
that
(
especially
after
a
patch
that
completely
shakes
the
meta)
.
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Design a Human-Friendly Ladder