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From here: http://zero-k.info/Forum/Thread/6531?page=2#120705
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From here: http://zero-k.info/Forum/Thread/6531?page=2#120705
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[quote]@GoogleFrog
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[quote]@GoogleFrog
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I think the Spy damage change was to make the target and health of the Spy more relevant. Most heavies require two Spies when on full health but perhaps one if damaged. Reaper is stunned for longer with two Spies. With 15k damage you could simply use one Spy vs most things in most situations, lacked nuance.[/quote]
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I think the Spy damage change was to make the target and health of the Spy more relevant. Most heavies require two Spies when on full health but perhaps one if damaged. Reaper is stunned for longer with two Spies. With 15k damage you could simply use one Spy vs most things in most situations, lacked nuance.[/quote]
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Makes sense from a design perspective, not sure it was needed for balance though. But at this point any reduction of cost, cloakcost, etc makes it better as an early commsniper (The abuse case). At 280 cost + 420 for the e, it doesn't compare very well against the Shockley at 30k EMP for 600 cost. They're mostly 1-shot, and neither of them have a guaranteed hit, though for different reasons.
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Makes sense from a design perspective, not sure it was needed for balance though. But at this point any reduction of cost, cloakcost, etc makes it better as an early commsniper (The abuse case). At 280 cost + 420 for the e, it doesn't compare very well against the Shockley at 30k EMP for 600 cost. They're mostly 1-shot, and neither of them have a guaranteed hit, though for different reasons.
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I wasn't sure the lineup was really hurting from the lack of anti-heavy, but... the real need for having a strong spy in the lineup would have to be in Crabe vs Crabe wars though, where though I've seen use and it seems viable, looking at the stats, it's half the cost of a Crabe if you include the E, and you need two to stun a stationary Crabe for only 10s (not the full 30s). That looks terrible for the spy when you include the coordination required from the Spies, the splash from the Crabe, decloak by wandering/burrowed fleas + the metal costs of units to kill a still fully armoured Crabe: And even if you get it while moving for the full 30s stun with 1 spy, it stops and immediately armours up anyway.
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I wasn't sure the lineup was really hurting from the lack of anti-heavy, but... the real need for having a strong spy in the lineup would have to be in Crabe vs Crabe wars though, where though I've seen use and it seems viable, looking at the stats, it's half the cost of a Crabe if you include the E, and you need two to stun a stationary Crabe for only 10s (not the full 30s). That looks terrible for the spy when you include the coordination required from the Spies, the splash from the Crabe, decloak by wandering/burrowed fleas + the metal costs of units to kill a still fully armoured Crabe: And even if you get it while moving for the full 30s stun with 1 spy, it stops and immediately armours up anyway.
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Spider vs Spider climaxes into Crabe vs Crabe very easy, I'm not sure this looks good for the counter mechanics here.
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Spider vs Spider climaxes into Crabe vs Crabe very easy, I'm not sure this looks good for the counter mechanics here.
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\n
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I've said before that spies are the counter in this matchup:
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http://zero-k.info/Forum/Thread/1126#8889
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Spy